9 I pray for them: I pray not for the world, but for them which thou hast given me; for they are thine. 10 And all mine are thine, and thine are mine; and I am glorified in them.
My response: Isn't this partially an argument of silence? How are we to know WHY Jesus did not pray for non-believers at this point? One of the reasons offered to me was that Jesus would in no way pray for the non-elect, because those would be unanswered prayers, and it is inconceivable that any of Jesus' prayers would go unanswered by His Father.
David observes: And who were the ones given there in John 17? The 11 disciples are the ones given. The disciples were not a reference to the elect as a total class. And secondly, in verses 21-22 he does pray for the world, as follows:
20 “My prayer is not for them alone. I pray also for those who will believe in me through their message, 21 that all of them may be one, Father, just as you are in me and I am in you. May they also be in us so that the world may believe that you have sent me.
Werner: Jesus is praying that through the unity of the ELECT, the world may believe in Him! This is an incredible thing. Here is a distinction between ALL those who will believe in Jesus and the world in general. Jesus prays for the unity of all believers (i.e. the elect) so that the world may believe! Reymond's evidence is non-existent at this point.
2 comments:
20 “My prayer is not for them alone [meaning the elect that is hearing Christ speaking at that particular time]. I pray also for those who will believe [these are the elect of the future that at some point in their lives will receive Christ]in me through their message [the disciples will spread the gospel but only the elect will respond], 21 that all of them [the elect at that time and the elect of the future] may be one, Father, just as you are in me and I am in you. May they also be in us so that the world may believe that you have sent me.
Benji, you did not deal with that part of the verse that seems tosound like Jesus is praying that through the unity oof the disciples, the world would come to faith!
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